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Re: who do you really, really like... NHL Hockey, my feeble hockey, Manchester Phoenix IHC and music, not just metal. Now got into bike road racing after watching the Tour de France latter stages live on TV then sitting through a 6 hour race in the Olympics. Wasn't expecting to enjoy the Olympics but so far lovin it. Ladies field hockey at the moment, that balls got to hurt when it hits you.

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Re: who do you really, really like... Metal Rob Halford Lynott Lemmy Brian Johnstone Angus & Malcolm Bon Ian Gillan Angry Anderson Dee Snider Kirk Windstein Ozzy Alice Cooper Rob Zombie Buch Dharma (BOC) Other Wattie (Exploited) Pinch (English Dogs/The Damned) Charlie Harper (UK subs) Roy Wood (The Move) Roger Daltry Dave Vanian (The Damned) Peter (Peter & Test Tube Babies) Wakey (The Weren't) Mickey Fitz (The Business) Jock (GBH) Roddy Moreno (The Oppressed) Non Music Rolf Harris Al Murray Arthur Daley Basil Fawlty Major (Fawlty Towers) Alan Partridge The Young Ones Eurovision Father Ted The World At War Tam Cowan (Scottish football pundit) Fishing Pheewwww!!!!! That's enough!

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Re: who do you really, really like... C.S. Lewis, Os Guinness, Mark Shea and G.K. Chesterton, as far as authors go. Some of my favorite philosophers of government are Thomas Hobbes, John Stuart Mill, Donald Allen and to a certain extent Alexis De Tocqueville. Also really like Robin Williams, Michael McIntyre, Rhod Gilbert, Miles Jupp, Jack Whitehall, and pretty much any of the regulars on Mock The Week as far as comedy goes. On the political front, I expect to find more admirable personages but so far I like Ron Paul and Ian Khama, president of Botswana.

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Re: who do you really, really like...

C.S. Lewis, Os Guinness, Mark Shea and G.K. Chesterton, as far as authors go. Some of my favorite philosophers of government are Thomas Hobbes, John Stuart Mill, Donald Allen and to a certain extent Alexis De Tocqueville. Also really like Robin Williams, Michael McIntyre, Rhod Gilbert, Miles Jupp, Jack Whitehall, and pretty much any of the regulars on Mock The Week as far as comedy goes. On the political front, I expect to find more admirable personages but so far I like Ron Paul and Ian Khama, president of Botswana.
Did Monty Python not write a song about those guys? "Socrates himself is particularly missed, A lovely little thinker but a bugger when he's pissed". :lol: I tend not to get 'close' to politicians-they have a terrible habit of letting you down...
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Re: who do you really, really like...

Some of my favorite philosophers of government are Thomas Hobbes' date=' John Stuart Mill, Donald Allen and to a certain extent Alexis De Tocqueville.[/quote'] I'm not big on political philosophy, I'm more into the metaphysical/epistemological side of it, but I can agree with you on John Stuart Mill. His principles are for the most part quite sound, but the way that they are utilized in politics/society can often negate their intended purpose.
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Re: who do you really, really like... Outside Metal: Hunter S Thompson - Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas is genius John Steinbeck Mary Boyle writer of Schizophrenia a Scientific Delusion? (2nd Ed.) - highlights the idiocy of biomedical psychiatry David Smail - The Nature of Unhappiness/ Illusion and Reality: The Meaning of Anxiety Bob Dylan Metal Rob Flynn Lemmy Geezer Butler

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Re: who do you really, really like...

Sure, that's why I delineate. Mill is less than impressive on the ethical side of things - utility is a weak substitute for justice - but his system for government is excellent. That said, system of government is dependent upon assumptions about rights and other ethical questions, which make the metaphysics indispensable.
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Re: who do you really, really like...

all this philosophy talk is bringing up memories of the hours I spent trying to understand Immanuel Kant
What I remember is his view on the ethical value of an action - namely that it ought to be judged on the intent rather than the result. His political views I need to go back to.
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Re: who do you really, really like...

What I remember is his view on the ethical value of an action - namely that it ought to be judged on the intent rather than the result. His political views I need to go back to.
This is basically the case. While intent is paramount, if you lack the ability to complete what you set out to do with good intentions, but do it anyway because of a poor judgment call, or you don't have the wisdom to think forward to all possible outcomes and repercussions, you can often end up doing more harm than good. In these cases, I can't agree with Kant, even Socrates believed that no man would willingly do evil, that it usually occurs from ignorance or selfishness (only doing good for you does not mean it's good for anyone else), but those circumstances can't be ignored just because you had good intentions.
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