MaxFaust

The above says "video not available" so I shall give Boris -- a favourite of mine -- with Merzbow -- another favourite -- the accolades they deserve, with respects to the video above the one right above ... a fine 8/10. I love that sort of thing. All they miss to make it a perfect day is Attilla on vocals ...

The Cumshots is what's passing for "mainstream death'n'roll" in Norway these days.

Dude, that's cheating. Everybody loves Rotting Christ !!! 9/10 ... and the one off clean ten is only on account of the fact that they've made better songs than this specific one ... which is still vastly superior to most of the boring droll out there. 

Seriously, guys. How is this even a discussion? It's painfully obvious that whatever and whoever is alive to carry on the metal torch RIGHT NOW trumps whatever came before by default. Who cares how great Judas Priest used to be or what a great guy Lemmy was in life? FFS ... look to the future. That's where shit happens. No disrsepect to the ancestors, but be real.

On high rotation on my car CD player right now: Venom -- Black Metal

Heh ... Ritual Carnage playing their song "Scars of Battle". This is my kind of shit. How to rate it? If I was at a show I'd say FUCKING ACE DUDE !!! with blood running down my crushed face ... but on record it's not really rising above the standard enough to warrant more than a solid 5/10.

22 hours ago, Balor said:

Breaking away from the herd provides one with an interesting level of objectivity about society that could not otherwise be achieved from within.

This is abso-fucking-lutely correct. What y'all young ones may not think about right now is ... where does this leave me 30 years down the road? As a time travelling reporter who's been there and seen that, I can inform you that you stand to gain exactly fuck all by giving up your independence of mind and body. Those who did invariably became old and fat and boring. Yeah they got some money, a bit of job security and a fine car or whatever, but they lost their souls. Keep that in mind, boys and girls. This battle isn't over until they start shovelling dirt down over your cold dead body.

1 hour ago, SpaceBrain said:

indulge in something dark, or heavy, or radical, or whatever it is.

That's generally called ritual magic. The point is "intellectual decompression".

People do it in many ways. Playing loud music and headbanging is helpful for dealing with edgy emotions. It's an outlet which is separated from the actual context those feelings exist within (that's what makes it ritual), but it's quite real, that fact notwithstanding, so that it works according to its purpose, without being the purpose in and of itself (that's what makes it magic). 

Some thoughts on "Optimistic Nihilism":

1 hour ago, RelentlessOblivion said:

You're not allowed to misrepresent that thing or it's significance.

Oh, so that's what you think happened here?

Pathetic. "Prog" has existed since the fucking 60s, man. During the 80s it was about Yes, Marillion, etc. There was no such thing as "prog metal" until quite recently. Queensryche was considered hair metal at least until they released Operation Mindcrime (after which they started to be taken more seriously). Trying to retrofit that shit and rewrite history (to support your own position of authority) won't work until all those who can actually remember how it went down have died out. 

No matter how high your quality of life may be, you're still going get old, get sick, and ultimately die.

That's like the most predictable thing of all.

As for Buddhist metal, I'd look to Japan. If Hindu (which is to Buddhism what the Catholic church is to Lutherans) does it, I have been quite fond of Rudra -- name for the Hindu storm god, like Thor or Zeus -- for quite some time.  

The blazing chariot refers, of course, to the scene from the Mahabharata, when Krishna tells Arjuna about the futility of life, death and suffering, also known as Bhagvad Ghita. (Relevant to the subject matter.)

It seems unlikely that SunnO))) is ever going to be the future of anything, let alone metal. I like some of what they're doing but it's all too intellectual and avantgarde. I'd categorize them with Chrome, Tuxedomoon and the Residents (or why not Merzbow?) rather than any metal band, save perhaps for some artists at the doomsier end of the scale. 

As for the rebel thing, I think the age of metal being controversial is a bygone era. Even black metal is mainstream here, for instance. They get support from the government, FFS. Nor are the metal kids so few and far inbetween that it's considered a safe thing to do to beat on them. Times change.

9 hours ago, FatherAlabaster said:

Funny how you think this argument is "eternally weak" when it comes to Butcher Babies, but somehow holds water when it comes to Queensryche.

Have I said that I dislike Queenryche? Or that they were "fake"? I said that they were among the better of the "light metal" bands. Besides, you're misquoting me. I said the position was weak, not the argument. Enough ad hominem though. Taste is ill suited for debate.

On 5/3/2018 at 3:21 AM, FatherAlabaster said:

I don't like seeing people suffer

Dude ... are you ever on the wrong planet. 

Life means suffering and inevitable death, probably in scary and painful ways. That's a fact. So buckle up and be ready.

On 5/8/2018 at 10:56 AM, Requiem said:

Are you sure the 1980s wasn’t a great decade to be a metal fan?

Any decade is a great decade to be a metal fan.

I'm just not with the choir that sings (nostalgic) praise to the times when grandpa was a young street punk. That's a bunch of fucking nonsense. There might have been a greater sense of being outcastes that were standing united against a cold front of ignorant "powers that be" ... but that's by and large because of the PMRC thing, that grew out of the Satan panic of the 80s. 

Nobody will deny you access to a pub just because you're wearing a patch that says Judas Priest nowadays ... so in that sense, it's easier to be into harder music ... also, even the most burgeoise housewife seem to have "full sleeve" tattoos nowadays, and stock market traders can have 20 piercings in the face and a blue mohawk, without this seeming strange. Times change.

4 hours ago, RelentlessOblivion said:

I do believe you misspelled progressive metal there mate. Oh and 1/10 if I want something that sounds like Motorhead I'll take the real thing thanks, they do it far better.

Nope. "Hair metal" may be somewhat misguiding ... so how about "light metal" (as opposed to heavy metal)? Progressive metal wasn't a thing until well into the 90s (at the earliest) ... whereas I formed my (low) opinion of Queensryche during the 80s. They were definitely in the "MTV circuit" (that were called hair metal, poodle rock, etc. at the time) of record company controlled high-budget productions that were churning out "products" rather than art. So you like them. So what? Not everybody's cup of tea. Fucking girly drama queens that they are. 2/10.

FYI, "biker rock" (of which Motorhead is a fine example) and/or "biker metal" was a thing long before Motorhead. Chapel may sound like Motorhead to the untrained ear, but that's because they're a biker band. Like these guys (from 1972):

The song is allright. The political propaganda is beyond lame. (Then again, everyone's a deep thinker nowadays. Brains no requirement, all you need is an accoutrement of base feelings. And a gun. How can that go wrong?) Anyway, looking away from the video, Queensryche were among the better of the 80s hair metal bands. I'll be generous and offer them 6/10.

On 5/4/2018 at 5:20 PM, BlutAusNerd said:

metal is best now because it truly is coming from everywhere

I second that. 

That whole 80s nostalgia thing never appealed much to me. Sure there were some good bands, but there were also a shitload of, well, shit. Those who think the 80s were so so metal can't possibly have been there at the time.

I purchased "The Devil You Know" by Heaven & Hell. Kickass album. Trad metal (I think).

Leprosy. Classic album by Death. A must-have in any reasonably cultured home.

On 5/2/2018 at 4:43 PM, Balor said:

For instance, many atmospheric bm bands use pictures of forests.

Seriously? Man, you have no idea what's lurking out in those forests, do you?

4 hours ago, Requiem said:

You don't really think they're signs of alien craft landing, do you?

Like I said: I don't know what to think. But alien spacecraft is pretty much an idiotic idea.

Whether they are revealed to be "fakes" (whatever the hell that means in this context) or some sort of prank ... depends on your standards for what's acceptable in terms of evidence. I've worked long enough in construction to be aware of how difficult it is to make that which is on paper happen in reality ... let alone without sophisticated equipment and during low visibility conditions of the night. Some of the crop designs (not all of them are circles proper) are mind boggling in their complexity. A couple of hours spent on the net will show you this. 

One particular crop design (known as "the Julia set" ... after a particular fractal mathematical function) manifested before the eyes of numerous spectators in 1996. It is of course entirely possible that it's all a hoax and that they're all in on the joke ... but that doesn't seem consistent with human nature. The two pranksters that have come forward claiming to have created all the crop circles were able to make fairly simple patterns only, whereas the larger (500 meters +) constructs would require fast and synchronized action on a rather massive scale, without even the slightest misstep. That just doesn't happen when humans do it.

Until someone comes up with a rational explanation, my money is on some kind of unknown natural phenomenon. Add to this that the larger bulk of these phenomenae has happened on the Salisbury plain, which has been a documented "cult place" for several thousand years before even Stonehenge was built. (Crop circles may just be a neat explanation for why humans started to construct stone circles in the first place.) This field of study attracts all kinds of looneys, though. So I'd be skeptical. If  it is something that "just happens" there's no telling what it means. Lots of people want to believe all kinds of weird shit though. 

New week, new playlist.

1. Judas Priest - British Steel

2. Vader - Reborn in Chaos

3. Captain Beyond - (self titled)

8 hours ago, Balor said:

deeply ingrained in modern culture

I suppose both Freddy Kruger and Jason ... hell, even Michael Myers are characters like that, with strong general recognition effect. "The zombie apocalypse" is a talking point that's become detached from the actual zombie genre. Some even use it in much the same meaning as in that movie "Idiocracy" (when stupid people get to rule the earth). That being said, I suppose "bizarre" may not be the word I'm looking for. My point is that it's more common than not for metal bands to use imagery that would make you think "horror movie" if it was used in a poster for some film. 

14 hours ago, BlutAusNerd said:

Fake tits, false metal.

That would actually make a kickass album title. 

The position form whence the work of other people seems fake or false or whatever is an eternally weak one. "Not to my liking" is fair enough, but what exactly is the whole "fake" thing about? I've seem that done to death over the years. Particularly as the 90s came to be ... and all kinds of "fake" shit was happening to those knights of the true and real metal. You are obviously not a stupid person so there must be some kind of rationale behind this position of defence. The anger (or whatever lies at the bottom of this issue) seems wasted to me. I don't get it. Why even feel anything at all? 

Ars longa, vita brevis ... as the saying goes. Life is short but art is long. It's like suing the government and spending the next 20 years on all sorts of legal rigmarole, so that even if you win the case, you've still spent a lot of valuable lifetime on something that's hardly worth wasting any amount of energy on to begin with. Me, I don't give a fuck. There is fun party music, then there is deep stuff that make me both think and feel. I am able to value both those things for entirely different reasons. There's also shit that I won't waste a moment's time on ... such as hair metal and "nu metal" ... but I don't think it's "fake", I just think that it's not to my liking. If other people like it, fine, let them listen to that crap. I don't mind. 

Butcher Babies say they are inspired by Wendy O. Williams. Being as old as I am, I remember the Plasmatics being called fake by the real and true punk rockers. I didn't care then and I don't care now. I've always liked the Plasmatics, however gaudy they were. So what? Who gives a flying fuck? I'm not arrogant enough to think that my personal tastes should be some kind of template for anyone else to build their sense of art appreciation upon, no matter what amount of people who are in agreement about what's "good" or not. I like Butcher Babies for entirely different reasons than, say, King Diamond or Sacred Reich, but I do like them. Be that as it may, the main point here is that they are just musicians. This is not an important issue.

Then there are bands like So Much Hate, that in their time were held to be a prime example of "Norwegian hard core" in their main market, which was Germany, where they were tremendously popular. Other Norwegian HC acts didn't like that. They were said to be "fake" ... and more a metal band than a proper HC act. I guess that would make them a "metalcore" band, mainly because their guitarist Børre -- one of many musicians who died because of drugs during the 90s -- was too good for his own good in the hard-ass scene that was 80s Norwegian hardcore, where guitar solos and grand riffery was considered indulgent nonsense that had no place in the "real and true" hardcore.

11 hours ago, BlutAusNerd said:

distort perceptions about what the sound is all about

 

Fenriz once mused a little on the standards and requirements of BM, according to him ... simplicity, low production values, organic sound, DIY attitudes at every level, etc. ... and I was reminded of the Dogma 95 movement that Thomas Vinterberg and Lars von Trier started, having rather rigorous (and outspoken anti-Hollywood) requirements to what sort of cinema they were envisioning. They wanted to strip the medium of film down to its bare essentials, focusing on the storytelling above all else. 

One of the "dogmas" was that of appropriating and putting to use anything that would serve to enhance the creative process. For a while, there were certain artists who would call black metal a "native Norwegian art form" ... which is a little strong, in my opinion, but I can certainly see the point they were trying to make. Insofar there is a metal band from Norway, it's supposedly a 75% chance that it's a black metal act, by direct form or by association to the "dogmas" that were laid down during the 90s. 

The creative ethics of the black metal movement reflects those of the punk rock movement that preceded it by a decade and some. This, in my opinion, is indisputable. The international cassette-exchange network was a typical "punk" thing (and in many ways a precursor to the internet based musical dissipation thing which is going on right now). I have no knowledge about to what extent this was happening in the earlier "proto-metal" era ... but I know for a fact that during my high school years, if one person had an LP with, say, Kiss or Budgie or Deep Purple, this meant that everybody had it, by way of making cassette copies. (Which of course did little for record sales, in the bigger picture, but it helped immensely in terms of "spreading the word".) 

Speaking of "memes" has become quite common these days ... but originally, a meme was defined as the lowest amount of information needed to transport an idea. (Defined by Richard Dawkins in 1974, I think it was.) The carrier medium for a meme can be just about anything ... but in terms of music -- unless you're good at reading notes -- there obviously need to be some kind of recording in the picture. The question is what level of "quality" you need. Or, indeed, how you define "quality" to begin with. Interesting sounds may be geek stuff for music nerds, like myself, but there is another school of thought that seems to be after "sound quality" along a completely different axis of parameters. (Typically the kind of people who are into gold speaker cables and stereo equipment that costs more than an average family car.) Funny thing is how in the 80s those people were into "digital mastering" whereas 30 years after, they are impressed by analog recordings. (Accept has a song on their latest album called Analog Man which touches upon this in a funny way.) But high-end equipment doesn't do shit for artistic quality, which was the point of both Fenriz's musings and the Dogma 95 boys. If anything, it distorts and obscures the actual artistry.

Oh well. This is WAY outside of the original focus of this thread ... but it'd be interesting to hear what you make of the Blessed Death song a little further up (in relation to BM) ... and also the Dirty Tricks song (last one as an example of trad metal). 

On 29.4.2018 at 2:51 PM, FatherAlabaster said:

Me.

Would you care to expand a little on this? Like I said, it seems to me like there's a connection between a taste for the bizarre in terms of music, and a taste for the bizarre in terms of other art forms, such as cinema and television (let alone what's reflected in the cover art and other "symbolism" of your average metal act). I'm genuinely curious.