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khaos
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TERRORHAMMER - Under The Unholy Command

TERRORHAMMER - Vintage Black Mass

VARIOUS ARTISTS - Get Back The Discharged Arrow

....I forgot just how great this compilation was...I remember finding this at HMV, of all places.....not my usual record store location, that's for sure....I tried to spend as little time on the Upper East Side as possible....except for maybe the occasional 25 cent Bass Ale Thursdays at Mumbles.....

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1 hour ago, SurgicalBrute said:

Why though? I don't think anyone here expects that those 10 albums are the only albums you like from a given year, or even that they're the only 10 you consider your favorites from that year, so I guess I wonder why the idea of not having every favorite would bother you so much? I mean, I think most of us start with big lists too, and I know I have a hard time choosing between one album or another at a certain level, but at the end of the day it's just a list on a message board. So if albums 9 and 10 are on the same level as albums 11 - 14, why does it matter which two make the list and which 4 get cut off? At that point they're essentially interchangeable, and you, presumably, know what your whole list of albums is already. So, outside of the rest of us just not seeing them, what changes for you personally if you were to only post 10 of those albums?

I know you've said this before, and that's fine...no one's saying you shouldn't, but if the point is to keep a record for your own use, wouldn't it be much easier to just use a spreadsheet, or a website like RYM which is specifically for that kind of thing? I mean, you must have so many arbitrary lists floating around now, it's got to be a pain in the ass to remember which threads you dropped them in. 

Like I've said more than once, they're not just lists on a forum, I save them for future reference. I try to update my lists every so often to include stuff I've found since the last time I made a master list. I'm not computer/tech savvy enough to know how to start my own spreadsheet, but I have figured out how to right click on my desktop and open a text document in notepad and type stuff in and save it. So that's where my lists are. I don't go look for them wherever I may have originally posted them on the board because we all know message boards don't last forever. Notepad is a low tech solution I suppose, not as cool as excel or google sheets but it works for me and it's a lot better than pen and ink with notebooks all over the place the way I used to do it.

Yes the 4 text documents I have on my desktop are all quite crowded now with all kinds of various lists by genre and by decade and of course all my year end lists going back 7 years. Lots and lots of lists. So it can still be hard for me to find stuff sometimes, I should really clean them up and organize it all better. I also keep a running list of albums I want to check out, or that I want to go back to again for future consideration, or ones that I'm ready to buy next time I'm buying. I also use notepad to work on long posts offline that are too long to finish in one sitting, like the very lengthy one I typed to you in response to your last post with the propaganda memes on that baptism thread, but then decided not to post because I know nobody cares except me. Maybe I'll pm it to you one day just because I spent hours researching and typing it. But you don't really care either.

Obviously if I wanted to I could just post a partial list of a random ten albums for each year even if my personal list had a few more albums, 13 or 15 or 18 or whatever number I ended up with, but why do that? I don't know what changes for me personally Surge, but why knock off random albums from my list just to meet some arbitrary requirement of 10? And why 10? Someone started the thread and just arbitrarily picked 10. Ok fine, so you guys can all do 10. I don't care, that's up to you.

Honestly every time I see one of you metal mavens post another list the first thing that pops into my head after I've read it is "hmmm I wonder what his next 10 would be?" It's like you yourself said earlier today, you don't think you could do an all time 100 death metal list because 100 isn't enough so you'd resort to just cutting random albums arbitrarily to get down to 100. That's exactly how I feel about "Top 10 albums of a given year" 10 just isn't enough for me. Your solution might be to simply not participate, and that's up to you. My solution is to let my lists go over.

I don't feel a need to make my own thread for yearly lists of 20 so I can be within the rules, because there's no punishment or personal injury incurred for going over, right? So I'm happy to just go with the 10 thread that's already there that we've all been posting on. Unless you guys have decided you're gonna vote me off the thread for being a dirty scofflaw or something, like that time Goldy messaged and asked me to stop participating in their Vortex rating thing because they didn't like my rating system and they said I was fucking up their spreadsheet. So the ball's in your court my dudes. If you want me to start a Top 20 thread and stay off the Top 10 thread I will.

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1 minute ago, RelentlessOblivion said:

I think 10 is more a guideline than a rule, I’m just slightly ocd so keeping my lists to ten is easier to live with. I’m also lazy so ordering my collection + Recs by year is the easiest way for me to organise things

I also like to think of these vintage albums in the context of the years they were released. Even though I seem to have so many of them mistagged. But everyone has their own way of organizing their shit that makes sense to them. There's no wrong way.

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54 minutes ago, GoatmasterGeneral said:

I don't know what changes for me personally Surge, but why knock off random albums from my list just to meet some arbitrary requirement of 10? And why 10? Someone started the thread and just arbitrarily picked 10. Ok fine, so you guys can all do 10. I don't care, that's up to you.

Only reason I asked was because you said it would legitimately bother you, and that if you had to confine it to 10 then it wouldn't be fun for you. So, I was honestly just curious what you felt the difference was that it would bug you like that. That's all.

 

Destroyer 666 - Phoenix Rising

 

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1 hour ago, RelentlessOblivion said:

I think 10 is more a guideline than a rule, I’m just slightly ocd so keeping my lists to ten is easier to live with. I’m also lazy so ordering my collection + Recs by year is the easiest way for me to organise things

My favourite thought for today was 'list crazed and list curious'. We all know where the GG sits on the spectrum and it's why we love him.

Although not strictly relevant to the issue of list lengths, I actually think that arbitrary rules are a good thing in the context of the creative arts. Staying inside a form/structure/convention in music/poetry/other forms of writing/the visual arts gives context and a degree of familiarity to the work which opens the door to the listener/reader/observer, and it is a challenge for the artist to create anew within the form - which can be pushed and shoved, squeezed and expanded. And sometimes blown away entirely, and this is a thing in itself. An obvious example here being 'free jazz' which wouldn't exist and would have no meaning if it were not for the rules and conventions of music in general, and all other jazz in particular.

That's what I think today anyway.

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28 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

My favourite thought for today was 'list crazed and list curious'. We all know where the GG sits on the spectrum and it's why we love him.

Although not strictly relevant to the issue of list lengths, I actually think that arbitrary rules are a good thing in the context of the creative arts. Staying inside a form/structure/convention in music/poetry/other forms of writing/the visual arts gives context and a degree of familiarity to the work which opens the door to the listener/reader/observer, and it is a challenge for the artist to create anew within the form - which can be pushed and shoved, squeezed and expanded. And sometimes blown away entirely, and this is a thing in itself. An obvious example here being 'free jazz' which wouldn't exist and would have no meaning if it were not for the rules and conventions of music in general, and all other jazz in particular.

That's what I think today anyway.

So correct me if I've got this all wrong Doc, but it sounds like you're saying that seemingly arbitrary rules can sometimes serve a purpose. So in those cases would they not therefore cease to be arbitrary?

 

29 minutes ago, MarkhantonioYeatts said:

BONEHUNTER - Sexual Panic Human Machine

 

Don't think that werewolf would have to hunt too bloody hard to find his bone.

 

Horna - Sudentaival, 2001 Finland

 

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1 hour ago, GoatmasterGeneral said:

So correct me if I've got this all wrong Doc, but it sounds like you're saying that seemingly arbitrary rules can sometimes serve a purpose. So in those cases would they not therefore cease to be arbitrary?

Hmm. Why sonnet form in poetry? Well, there was a history and an evolution toward it no doubt, but why stop at 14 lines? It could be 12, or 16 or even 13 if we are getting weird. So, in the end, the 14 lines etc is arbitrary. There is no reason for it to be this way other than it is agreed that this is sonnet form and that is not. 

ABSENT IN BODY - Plague God

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2 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Hmm. Why sonnet form in poetry? Well, there was a history and an evolution toward it no doubt, but why stop at 14 lines? It could be 12, or 16 or even 13 if we are getting weird. So, in the end, the 14 lines etc is arbitrary. There is no reason for it to be this way other than it is agreed that this is sonnet form and that is not. 

So are you saying Doc that you think thrash metal would still be more popular today if they had instituted an arbitrary rule that its lyrics could only be in sonnet form if it were to be considered thrash?

Seriously though, your example does not enlighten me or answer my question because since you admit the arbitrary 14 line rule serves no real purpose, we can all agree it remains arbitrary. We understand that rules which serve no purpose can generally be considered arbitrary. I need to know about arbitrary rules that inadvertently serve a useful purpose. Once this purpose has been identified, can we safely revoke their arbitrary status?

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2 hours ago, GoatmasterGeneral said:

since you admit the arbitrary 14 line rule serves no real purpose, we can all agree it remains arbitrary.

Yep but that's me point. It is arbitrary, but if you accept that and write a sonnet -  compressing imagery, emotion, ideas, word play into that arbitrary form, then that is a singular and disciplined artistic achievement and you enter into the lineage and tradition of those who have written sonnets. And maybe your sonnet does it all better, or in some way differently.

If you want to write a thrash metal song then you accept the stylistic features of thrash metal and go for it. There is no reason to constrain yourself to thrash metal but you choose to do so. And if you create a worthwhile work of art with those constraints then that too is a singular and disciplined artistic achievement. I think. I don't really care for thrash metal, it's for cucumbers.

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16 hours ago, SurgicalBrute said:

Only reason I asked was because you said it would legitimately bother you, and that if you had to confine it to 10 then it wouldn't be fun for you. So, I was honestly just curious what you felt the difference was that it would bug you like that. That's all.

I have issues with authority. Especially when it comes to 'rules' I've decided are arbitrary and serve no good purpose. Shit like list limits, speed limits and seat belt laws. 

 

8 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Yep but that's me point. It is arbitrary, but if you accept that and write a sonnet -  compressing imagery, emotion, ideas, word play into that arbitrary form, then that is a singular and disciplined artistic achievement and you enter into the lineage and tradition of those who have written sonnets. And maybe your sonnet does it all better, or in some way differently.

If you want to write a thrash metal song then you accept the stylistic features of thrash metal and go for it. There is no reason to constrain yourself to thrash metal but you choose to do so. And if you create a worthwhile work of art with those constraints then that too is a singular and disciplined artistic achievement. I think. I don't really care for thrash metal, it's for cucumbers.

 

I'm cool accepting the stylistic features and limitations of the established musical sub-genres I like, and in fact I actively look for bands who can work within those constraints. It's execution not innovation I care about. I thought you were a guy who was out there looking for some envelope pushing. But these constraints we speak of then aren't arbitrary, are they? They serve a useful purpose for those of us who want our death metal to sound like death metal and our black metal to sound like black metal without too much experimentation or influence from outside genres like the dreaded prog.

I have no problem following rules in life that I agree with, even if they were originally arbitrary. It's the rules and policies I don't happen to agree with where I run into problems. I'm not talking about breaking the law (aside from some traffic laws) or being a troublemaker, I just mean following all the stupid little rules we're faced with in everyday life. This is why I backed out of enlisting into the military at the 11th hour. I knew I would not have been able to keep my mouth shut and just accept being ordered around and told what to do. I used to wonder sometimes if I would have been better off if I'd just gone with it.

But wait, are you saying you never liked thrash metal Doc? Not ever, not even a little back in the day? No Metallica or Megadeth albums in your shady past? You're not one of us then. For all our squabblin', me and Kuke were cut from the same cloth. We were headbangers back in the mid 80's when I guess you must have already gotten started your illustrious career popping pimples. Guess you liked to stay above the fray, didn't wanna get your hands dirty. So if you don't mind me asking, what did your journey to metal look like Doc? You went from 70's prog and modern classical and Midnight Oil and Aussie pub rock right straight to Krallice and progressive atmo-post-black?

 

 

Ebony Pendant/Lamp of Murmuur - Plenilunar Requiems - Split, this is excellent.

 

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Your loyalty was never in question brother. Just your whereabouts.

 

Misery/Extinction of Mankind – Apocalyptic Crust, split 2001 

 

2 hours ago, markm said:

He's baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack!

Every so often I have to shoot him a text and ask what he's been up to, which generally ends up bringing him back into the fold. You know how life can be sometimes, when you're a busy dude with a lot on your plate a few months can slip away without even realizing it.

 

Silvio: Just when I thought I was out... they pull me back in

 

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