gus666

At times bands can infuriate me. They can have extensive back catalogues and yet stick to the same set lists year in, year out. Even the ones which change the set lists seem to omit some classics or have never played them. Here's a few of mine: AC/DC - Down Payment Blues, Love at First Feel, Touch Too Much, Go Down, Ride On. Motorhead - Won't Pay Your Price, Back At The Funny Farm, Iron Horse, Poison. Thin Lizzy - Fools Gold, Soldier Of Fortune, Toughest Street In Town. Iron Maiden - Remember Tomorrow. Saxon - Taking your Chances Black Sabbath - Never Say Die

Here's a controversial opinion about metal (with apologies to out US friends): I can't stick the metal jargon and phraseology we have to put up with in the UK? Journalists/broadcasters/DJs all trying to sound 'cool' and American. Coming out with crap like 'cool' and using the word 'shit' to describe just about everything. Oh, and how they're 'stoked' about a new album and how any pub band is 'awesome'. And, of course, worst of all, using the word 'dude'. Unacceptable under any circumstances and should be punishable by death-by-dog shite in this country (UK). FFS you're British! Speak your own bloody language! If I wanted to read all this rubbish I'd buy American magazines!

Hardly surprising, Dave. Britain's worst ever casualties at the Battle Of The Somme. 19,000 men died on the FIRST day. Songs don't make me cry, but Crowbar's To Touch The Hand Of God is a really dark, sad song. Brilliant.

Noticed a few Maiden riffs mentioned, but what about Samson? Some great riffs: Walking Out On You (from Head On) Hammerhead (from Head On) Vice Versa (from Head On) Riding With The Angels (from Shock Tactics) Bright Lights (from Shock Tactics)

And don't forget Neon Nights, Restless!

I've said it before and I'll say it again-the term 'heavy metal' means different things in the different decades of music. So it's a changing debate as time goes on. But, in the '70s, '80s (and probably the '90s) BOC were considered a heavy metal band. As were many (AC/DC, Lizzy, UFO, Led Zepplin, Judas Priest etc). Their fans liked all these bands, and it was almost exclusively heavy metal fans who liked them. They were in that 'genre'. Queen were never considered as heavy metal. Ever. A rock band in the context of The Who or Stones. It was more a case of some metal fans liked them, as opposed to Queen fans being generally heavy metal fans. Can't speak about the other band.

Driller, when you say 'genre' do you mean metal genres, as in this discussion, or do you mean genre in general (like dance/indie etc)?

Was listening to an all-time classic the other day, what a brilliant riff- Saxon-Princess Of The Night.

Driller, I know exactly the roots of rock n roll and the link to Motorhead and AC/DC, and more. But Motorhead ain't rock n roll. Yes, there's songs, especially the recent albums, that are R n R, but they've definitely went more for that sound in the last 5/6 albums than they did on the early classics. Also, if they play rock n roll all the time, why does Lemmy always say "Here's a rock n roll song for you..." before playing Born To Raise Hell (an undeniably R n R song)? He never says that before playing The Hammer or Overkill etc. As I said in a reply to Blut, it's not so much the original rock n roll I've got a problem with, it's the new versions of it. I still say it's easier to play and is a cop-out to trying to do something truly original. The present day punk scene is riddled with it for example. Of course you could disect, analyse and you'll get rock n rock from nearly any band in the 'heavy' bracket, and yes, AC/DC and Motorhead may have more R n R overtones than, say, Lizzy or UFO. But, The (Burger) King would be spinning in his grave if he thought he was being classed in the same genre as those two bedlam creators!

I think you've misinterpreted what I was meaning, Blut. Maybe my fault in explaining it properly. Sure, I don't really go a bundle on the original rock n rollers, but, as you say, they were innovative and the best in their day. It's the modern day "rock n rollers" I cannot stick. That's the lazy music. It's already been done. And so's their bloody dress sense! Listen to bands nowadays which have that undeniable rock n roll sound-there's nothing new there, whatsoever. It's all so bloody contrived! Remember when Gary Moore couldn't write a decent hard rock tune? Folk stopped going to see him and stopped buying his albums. So what did he do?? He went and "played the blues, maaannnn." Then all the middle age bores went ape for him. It's the same thing. And loads of people call AC/DC rock n roll-mainly folk who like them but are not into other 'hard rock' bands. And AC/DC themselves regularly refer to themselves as rock n roll (how many songs of their's have "rock n roll" in the title?). But even if they were rock n roll, (which I doubt), they took Chuck Berry influences and created something totally original for the time. Ditto The Ramones. The modern day "rock n roll" bands are just trying to take an easy route to success, and that's bad for fans of exciting, guitar based rock/metal/punk or whatever. I've got the Motorhead logo tattooed on my arm, but if Headcat played in my back room I'd go upstairs and turn the telly up.

You'll have to be a bit older, maybe, to appreciate this controversial opinion, but I HATE "rock n roll". Okay, there's some bands who are definitely rock n roll that I like; The Ramones, The Fuzztones, those garage/mod/psychadelic bands of the '60s. BUT! I detest the 'rock n roll' stereotype image-the rock bands who try and look like James Dean, slick back hair, turn-up jeans, leather jacket. I also detest those rock n roll trendies-they've got to have the swallows and playing cards tattoos, don't they? It's so "old school". And the girls have got to have bright red lip stick and a head scarf. My favourite bands include AC/DC and Motorhead. Folk now call them rock n roll. No they're not. Would Elvis have gone to a AC/DC gig if he hadn't eaten his body weight in burgers? Doubt it... And could you see the likes of Buddy Holly playing a cover of Overkill at 129 decibels? No! Rock n roll is a lazy, easy music to play-like pub blues. Anyone can play it. The classic rock/metal bands of the '70s may have been influenced by them, but they didn't play anything like that crap. Rock n roll is so bloody twee it makes me sick. Its usually bands who feel uncomfortable or snobby about the term 'metal' who label themselves rock n roll. As Brighton punks Peter & The Test Tube Babies sang: Elvis is dead Thank god! What a fat c@nt he was!

Here's another-Belle And Sebastion Actually, that's a lie-I don't like them, but! Wee Stuart Murdoch was a very good friend of mine. Wee played football and went to school together for years and I delivered papers to his mum's hoose. Me and my best mate Mossie took him to his first ever gig- Magnum at Ayr Pavillion. The wee man was star-struck. When he saw a roadie walking past he ran up to him and asked for his autograph! I hate indie, but I hope Belle do brilliant. Fannnies...

Just because. No, only joking, YES were OK as a prog band (lots of rock fans who liked metal liked them) but that Lonely Heart was like Kiss's I was Made For Loving You... Just sh!t stirring mate!

I mean, Satan....

Ensiferum Zimmers Hole Grand Magus Rainbow Gojira Thanks Santa!!

This is a superhero. And he's real.

I'll tell you what's a good album-Pure by Numan. Very dark and mysterious. He wrote it after one of his kids (unborn maybe?) died. A genuine legend in an age of nobody's.

I honestly can't see that Blut. They may be different in style/structure to some, but IMO they're still metal, and not just because I like them. I think it's largely a 'face-fitting' thing with some of the metal fans rather than a musical dislike. Especially with Slipknot when they had a load of very young kids wearing their t-shirts.

Metal fans can be very snobby about other 'styles' in metal. For instance, Slipknot, System Of A Down and Trivium are metal bands that get slated, not always for their music, but their fanbase, image etc. But they're all metal bands, yet some poppier bands like Nightwish seem to live a charmed life. I get frustrated at metal fans who have this attitude because we really need all true metal (I don't mean fannies like Manowar) bands to ensure the survival of the music. Put it this way; I can't stand Metallica but I'm glad they're around. It's good for metal.

It's true-ask anyone. Smells like a kipper's vagina.